Supply Chain
Technology Podcast

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

sustainability, carbon neutrality, CO2 emissions, supply chain, decarbonization, data quality, carbon accounting, predictive analytics, transport logistics, fleet operators, carbon ERP, internalization, actionable insights, automation, sustainability managers

SPEAKERS

Jakob Muus, Scott Mears

Scott Mears  00:07

Welcome to the Supply Chain Tech Podcast with Roambee. Scott Mears here, Global Field Marketing Manager at Roambee and one of the hosts of the Supply Chain Tech Podcast. We thank you for joining us today. In this episode, we speak with Jakob Muus. Jakob is the Director of the Sustainability Tribe at Transporeon. Throughout his career, he’s been on a journey to drive the transportation industry’s transformation towards greater efficiency and ecological sustainability. Today we discuss how Jakob has been helping companies achieve their 2030, 2050, goal, to become carbon neutral or carbon negative. Thank you, Jakob for joining us today. I really appreciate you coming on.

Jakob Muus  00:55

Thank you.

Scott Mears  00:56

Awesome. Before we jump into the meat of this episode. I always like stuff with an icebreaker, and I would love to know first, if you could have any superpower in the world, what would it be? And why?

Jakob Muus  01:15

Oh, that’s a good one. What would it be? Superpowers? We don’t really need any, do we? Oh, teleportation, teleportation. That would be great. Interesting. That would be super. I mean, it’s just a little bit tedious to travel, isn’t it? It would save a lot of CO2 just to teleport to where you want to go. I think teleportation would be a good superpower to have.

Scott Mears  01:43

Awesome that happens to be mine as well. So the same power, superpower? Yeah, I think it’d be wonderful to go all the way far back in history or all the way forward in the future and see what we turn into. See if Elon Musk is right, no, it’s always good, and now people know a little bit more about you. And as we’ve I really want to jump in today about sustainability, focusing on everyone is really aiming to become carbon neutral by 2030 everyone’s got their carbon neutral goals. They’re working towards their goals. And today I really want to understand and evidence where we’re currently at with we’re tracking this, where we need to how, what we need to do to get there, and how we get there. So first of all, I want to understand the solutions out there that are looking, to understand, bring numerical value to CO2 emissions for us to get to where everyone’s trying to get to. So first of all, I understand is today can definitively put a number to the CO2 emissions of our global supply chains.

Jakob Muus  02:55

No, we, we probably can’t. It is, it is a it is a huge problem, and it’s the first problem we need to tackle. What makes me very happy is to see that companies have started to tackle this problem. We see very innovative startups who are helping companies making it easy. The problem is from economic perspective, the fact that we, over the last 100, let’s just say, 100 years, maybe 150 years, have decided more or less proactively, to ignore CO2 emissions as an externality. And the economic term of externalities, of course, are are things that we we know are there as a cost, but they’re so difficult to measure that we ignore them. So externalities are inherently difficult to measure. They otherwise we would have measured them one time or another. So now, after all these years, the cost of CO two emission have been ignored, and that has, of course, helped some industries. We have airline systems who can sell could sell air tickets for 20 euros to go from anywhere in the UK to anywhere in Europe. That was because they didn’t have to pay for the CO two emissions in it. But what is happening at the moment is that we’re internalizing this. And this is a fantastic example of an internalization of externalities. What’s happening right now, we’re starting to we’re being forced to start measuring CO two emissions on the different operations. What I’m seeing is that companies have started to realize this. It often starts with the CFO office saying, seriously, we need to decarbonize by 2050 some of them even by 2030 and then they go to each and every one of their sea levels and say, You decarbonize. You decarbonize. You do. Your eyes. And in some of the departments, it’s easy. If you if you manage the buildings, then it’s easy. You can measure how much energy the buildings are consuming. You can see what the how many kilowatt hours you bought last year. You can also get a message from your energy provider and ask for the carbon mix, and you can come to a point where you can say, this is the CO2 emission in our building maintenance, and then you can find a way to decarbonize it. But the biggest problem will always be in transport logistics and supply chain, because often there we don’t even know what happened just one step before. If you are a car producer, you have 1000s of parts that flowed into this car. And if you really need to measure these CO2 emissions for this product, you need to follow every single screw down to the mine and say how much CO2 was added to this product all the way into the car. So the first thing we see is that the CFO is saying we need to decarbonize. Then everyone realizes, in order to decarbonize, we need to measure then often it takes two years for the companies to measure the CO2 emissions and all the operations. But because they don’t really have too much information about it, my experience is that there’s an error rate, especially in the supply chain, transport and logistic part of around two to 400% so you have an error rate where you sort of say, circa this. This is the amount the next step we always see with the companies, and this is where we see the maturity of some of the biggest companies in the world that are happening right now is that they’re realizing they can never make a strategic decision with a 400% error rate. So the next step they need to do is to start getting better data and understanding the data and using the data as well. Because especially when it comes to transport, logistics and supply chain, we sort of we have the advantage that if we can get better data and if you can optimize CO2 emission, it will always also mean an optimization of your of your system, so whole system optimization. So what we’re seeing is a maturity that comes some companies are already still at the point where I say, Do we really need to measure CO2? Other companies are yes, we measure to but we don’t need the good data quality and other companies, again, the front runners are there where they say, yes, we need to measure CO2 emissions, and we need to measure on all our operations, and we need to get the the most precise measurements on all our operations. So back to your questions, do we have companies that have this precise measurement? Yes, but they are often very simple in that supply chain. I don’t even even the best customers we have those who are furthest ahead have some blind spots in their supply chain. It is really a complex task. But the good news is that there are many companies working on getting this sold.

Scott Mears  07:58

Understood that that’s really interesting, to see. And I like the breakdown of the three types of companies out there. And I guess what you’re saying is that they’re on three different paths at the moment, and wherever you are, it’s still, might say, a very good one. But still, would you agree in approximating to what that number is? Do you believe that approximation is better than us doing nothing.

Jakob Muus  08:23

Yes, definitely, definitely. I mean, this is one of those things where we see some of our customers come from a, I would say, a technical background, or engineering background, where sort of, like, let’s plan everything and then implement, yeah, but this is one of those things where you need more, I’d say like an IT product management mind, because you need to think iteratively. Start measuring today, and it doesn’t matter if you have 400 or 2,000% error rate, because then you will see where is my biggest result of investment in investing in better data and better information. So iteratively, day by day, year by year, can come to this exact point where you have data in a quality where you can have actionable insights. So yes, I’m definitely my if I can give my customers one message, it is, start today. No matter how bad the data is, just start today. Absolutely.

Scott Mears  09:24

I love that message, and I would love to understand how is, and I appreciate there’s different levels of technology out there that are approaching this in a different way. So I don’t know whether you silo off the different types of technologies trying to do this, but how are technology on, sort of a basic understanding how they how are they doing this, approximating this, what is it they’re doing when, when I send my shipment from A to B across the world, what is it that this technology is doing in order to give me that figure?

Jakob Muus  09:56

So the good thing that has happened in this industry, um. In the last couple of years is that we have started to gather some standards for carbon accounting. And I, like, I don’t know how deep I should go into this, but there are, like, teeny, tiny differences between carbon accounting and and real carbon measurement that two different, like, they could be different. It has to do with how you allocate the CO2 emissions to the different shipments. But thanks to the fantastic work of organizations like smart freight center with the glac framework, we have seen that we have gathered a standard in how to do carbon accounting, it’s becoming the ISO standard. I expect it’s going to be published in February 2023, where there is sort of a rule of thumb on how you measure CO2 emissions and all tools out there. And I can only tell customers. I’ll tell it over and over again. I will even say it if I if I wasn’t selling tools like this, but I would say, don’t do it yourself. It’s too complex, and you need the data infrastructure with too many different subcontractors and two different ways of calculating. Find a tool that does it, find a good tool that does it, and good tool that’s able to handle many different ways of calculating. But what the tools have in common is, if they’re accredited by smart freight center, if they’re accredited to calculate according to black, they have the ability to give you a CO2 emission accounting if you just have ton, kilometer and mode. But they can also give you a CO2 emission accounting if you have, like, all the fuel consumption every single milliliter of diesel that has been spent on the trip, and every single shipment that was on port the trip, so that you can allocate the CO2 emission from the fuel into the shipments. Those are the two extremes. The first one is called default, so we just know ton, kilometer and mode, and we just need to, like, put some number. It’s an average and an industry average. And the other one is the extreme that we call primary absolute. It’s based not on per ton kilometer, but just on the fuel spend. And then we just allocate the grams of CO2 to the different shipments. And those are the two extremes. And a good tool is able to handle all kinds of data quality, so everything that’s in between. Sometimes we know the truck license plate, and we can sort of identify the engine size and the age of the engine. We can put some factors on it. We can come closer and closer to reality, the thing that we call the data funnel. So when we talk about CO2 emission accounting in transport, yeah, the tools simply need to be accredited, and they need to be able to handle all the data qualities we have, because then you always ensure as a customer, you always get an automated and accredited measurement of CO2, and every time your subcontractors give you more and more information of what happened out there, you will come closer and closer to reality and start getting actionable insights from your data.

Scott Mears  13:05

That’s really interesting that you mentioned there’s, there’s going to be a stand coming up to the first quarter of next year. That really is an interesting feat that would really define how to combat this moving forward. And you’re totally right. I agree. When it comes to don’t do it yourself, we have the same conversations from around the side when we we meet prospects that that are trying to do it themselves, and usually a year later, they come back and go. That’s it was a bit more complex than we had first understood, and we’ve been through that journey. So it I understand why you say this, and I feel like this really leads on to what infrastructure comes companies need. Because, I mean, you were saying the two levels of of recording this, and very much the absolute one would would demand a lot more data inputting and a lot more resource through the automations of even pulling that data. So what infrastructure does a company need to adopt this technology? And second on to that is, what infrastructure do they need to actually implement this information? Because it’s, again, we have those conversations a lot. It’s all good with lighting up the supply chain with these figures, but which tells me I need to improve this, and this is good and this is bad, but if I can’t do anything with it, then what value is this to me? So what level of infrastructure do they need to really adopt and really use this technology?

Jakob Muus  14:35

I would say that if we stay on the shipper side, and shipper is something I would hear just identity like just, just use the term for anyone who buys transport. Yeah, I know LSPs are both shippers and carriers in many of these scenarios, but if we stay on the shipper side, do. As long as you’re able to know ton, kilometer and mode, then you can do CO2 emission accounting. But if you use tools like the Transporeon carbon intelligence tool, it would be, I would say an overkill to use it if you just have the three things, because the magic is, of course, the fourth thing, some kind of identification that can help you identify the carrier, again, defined as anyone who sells transport the carrier who has been transporting the things, maybe even vessel, number, vehicle license plate and other kinds of identification tools. So if you have shipment numbers, identification tools, but these are quite simple, almost all shippers out there have that in their transport management system. So basically, what we need from the customer, from the shipper. Customer is ton, kilometer and mode in one way or another. The kilometer can also just be address for pickup and address for drop off. And then we will be able to match with with the carrier who’s been transporting it. And if we then go to the carrier, if the carrier is an LSP, we can match to his subcontractors. And we will then, in the background, sit and do all the infrastructure, the coordination, making sure, oh, that matches with this vehicle that was driving on the highway back then last week. And we can then go in and see, do we find the fuel consumption of the stretch and do we find out what was on board? If not, do we then have other indicators. If not, do we have other indicators? If not, then we’ll just put the default on it. So basically, what we see is that the we do everything we can to ensure our customers, no matter if they’re like no matter if they’re shippers or LSPs or pure carriers and fleet operators, we make sure that this automated, that you just need to find these, these, these papers, and you get a monthly or weekly, whatever you want, accredited report on your CO2 emissions. Now, the second part of it, and that’s what’s so special about our product carbon intelligence, is that we allow for these companies also to generate API connections into their company. That has something to do with the fact that, as I said before, some companies just say, oh, I need a footprint. I don’t care. But there are other companies that are further in their journey. They say, actually, I, as a transport manager in a big shipper, don’t need to know much about my CO2 emissions, my CFO needs it, or the strategy department or the sustainability department, and often we need to be able to send this disaggregated calculations on a shipment level up into a carbon ERP, or ERP system that can then disaggregate the shipment and say, like, how many chocolate bars was on this euro palette. We don’t know that, but we can send the data so that that can be disaggregated, and every single chocolate bar can sort of get a CO2 measurement allocated to it. So we do see that in order to measure CO2 emission, just to get back to your question, to audit COVID mission, you need to be able to know your tongue, collaborator, involved in one way or another. But when you have done this, we will be able to, sort of like, start measuring today, improve your data, and when you’re ready for it, you can start consuming the data. And the different systems in your company depends on on where you’re going to need it, so to speak.

Scott Mears  18:37

interest so that that very much you’re saying they already are collecting a lot of this data already, so which makes makes the shift a lot easier. And when it comes to an educating point of view to where do you feel the education needs to happen? Do you feel there needs to be a mindset shift? You’re saying it needs it doesn’t even know the shipper is gathering that information. It actually needs to be sent to the senior level to sustainability department. What is it you feel? Do you feel there needs to be a mindset shift here? Or do you feel that’s already been driven by by the charges that are likely to come in very soon?

Jakob Muus  19:21

I think, I think my life became much easier when this became a CFO topic at the shippers, I do see that some of our customers, some big companies and big brands, they have sustainability managers who have worked on the topic of sustainability and transport longer than I have. So we do see that sometimes I learn from the customers. The problem is often, and everyone who has worked in a big corporate knows this, the problem is often that at the end of the day, you have a budget in the transportation department, you also often very squeezed, and every cent counts, and suddenly you come around the corner and say, Hey, I need X amount of 1000s of euros to do this to ensure that we can decarbonize by 2030 before the CFO was involved. People would say, No, forget about it. You can do it as something like now, as it’s a CFO topic, we get this attention, and it’s not so much about the money. The money is important. But you cannot imagine how difficult it is to get the resources internally in the IT department to focus on on CO2 emissions in a time where there’s so many TMS, roll outs and so on happening. So I don’t think that we need much education. I think that things are coming. And I do feel these three stages of customer maturity is something that comes more or less automatically. The different industries. Some industries are further than others, fast moving. Consumer Goods, automotive are very far building. The building industry is starting, and some other industries are a little bit like they say, we will be ready when we’re ready. And yeah, so I do see it, but I’m also a born optimist, so I just hope that, just to circle down to this, I see that our customers are often more clever than us. I do see that the problem is a structural problem that it’s sort of like and as soon as the CFO says, I don’t care how you do it, but give me a precise and automated measurement on a product level, then the customer knows that we’re sitting here and we are ready to do it.

Scott Mears  21:39

Interesting. And further to that, how, how do we engage our subtractors and our couriers to really take action on this? Because there’s a big trade off between the time and the money, and how do we really engage them to take action.

Jakob Muus  22:01

I must say, like I started in this industry, focusing very much on fleet operators, and my heart burns for them, like when I started my former company tracks, it was with the focus on Finding ways to make it easier for fleet operators in road freight to optimize fuel consumption. Because I do find it, I do find it’s a funny industry, because there’s almost no barriers to entry. So we have almost perfect competition. And perfect competition is something you sort of only hear about or read about in the textbooks. When you study economy, it doesn’t exist in real life, except for very few industries. I find it amazing that they are so good at their work. They are under so much pressure. Is so fantastically good at what they’re doing, and still, they get so much bad rep no matter what they do, and it doesn’t matter if it’s a fleet, big fleet operator, if it’s a small owner, driver, I’ve been driving along with truck drivers. I’ve been sitting next to dispatchers in the offices. That is a tough job, and it’s rarely rewarded. So I always wanted to see, how can we do something that’s carrier first. So everything we’re doing, everything we’re trying to do, is to make sure that we make life easier for them. So the first thing we have decided to do at Transporeon is that on the carrier side, first of all, we are offering an automated way of doing creating these CO2 reports for each and every one of their shippers, so the shipper doesn’t have to be a conspiracy. So you can create a report, and you can make a PDF. You can send it to them. I do see the CO2 emission accounting a little bit like so annoying things like paying for toll roads or registering your driver time. So things that you have to do but you don’t really feel is giving you much. So what we’re turning it around and saying, if you send us the data for it, we can help you make automated reports that you can send to your shippers with your logo on it. It’s accredited reports, and it can help you get the next get the next contract, and maybe even get a discount on the next contract, because you will save CO2 for them again. CO2 is being internalized, and you can put a value on CO2 suddenly. So this is what we’re trying to do. We’re trying to make sure that the carrier doesn’t pay. The most important thing that you always need to do when you do stuff like this to make sure that the shipper will never, ever, ever, ever, ever see the fuel consumption of the carrier. It is a company secret. And what we do, we have a very a Chinese war between the shippers to reporting and the carrier sending us data for doing the CO2 reporting, and the shipper will never get it. Shipper will never be able to go back and say, Oh, you had the CO2 per ton kilometer, meaning you were spending this amount of money on fuel that that would be like, that would be one. So we always very, very secure that we keep these two things separated. Yeah, and the last thing is that we are also trying to help the carrier. Then when the shipper comes to us and says, how do we then lower CO2 emissions? Again, we’re taking the data for actual insights, and we’re trying to push it over and say, Hey, if you buy this carrier, an electric vehicle of this route, you will save this amount of CO2 and then suddenly we can sort of shift money from the shipper side to the carrier side, and everyone wins, because, again, CO2 emissions have been internalized. The CO2 emission has a value for the shipper, and we translate it into that he can, sort of like spend money on paying the extra costs in in leasing so that the carrier can actually invest in electric. Start driving electric. Start having a little bit higher income on it, and, you know, save the money here and put it there, so to speak.

Scott Mears  26:09

That’s really positive, that value add, that you’re positioning that as it’s it really is a value add to the carriers that they can offer this, transparency really does help. And moving on to the predictive side you mentioned, you’re mentioning about how this can takes to another predictive saying, Hey, we now know that this lane or this mode of transport is you could change this, and it would be much more efficient. What What have you seen so far? How are shippers at the moment, and how can they in the future, really use this data to predictively analyze and plan consciously, of CO2 emissions.

Jakob Muus  26:55

It actually goes very well. I mean, the difficulty has always been prediction, prediction of CO2 emission. If it was easy to predict CO2 emission, we wouldn’t need the primary data. I mean, it makes sense. If we can say this is going to happen tomorrow, then we do need to see what actually happened tomorrow. We can just make sort of per ton kilometer and then. But as I just mentioned before, if we only had 10 kilometer and mode, we will have up to 400% error rate. And if we have a little bit more information, we could have 25% error rate, which is a little bit too high to do any kind of good strategic decisions. Having very granular data enables us to use AI or digital twins to create predictions, and that is what we are using right now. So we’re working with different internal systems at Transporeon to make sure that they are getting enabled during 2023 that you can optimize your decision making, using that as an example, when you do dispatching, you often just optimize on time and money, yeah, so what does it cost? How long time does it take with the CO2 emission predictions on it, you are able to optimize time, money and CO2, and that means that inter internal system will send us a call, example, if tomorrow, this truck from this subcontractor, or this truck from this subcontractor, or this truck from this subcontractor will drive, what would the CO2 emissions be, and we will be able to tell you with a with 2 to 5% error rate, what the CO2 emissions is going to be on the different this is something we are have been we’re rolling out right now with, with modal intermodal decisions, meaning, if we take this shipment, go over land to this railway, go by rail to the end point, and then go by road to to the drop off. How much time will it take? It’s something someone else will calculate for us. How much money will it cost? Someone else will calculate it for us, but how much CO2 will it cost? And there we just create the predictive analytics of different things, and we send it back to the decision making tools for dispatching, for procurement, for different kinds of decision making, we’ve seen that we can really save a lot of CO2 on it, but our biggest, most important principle, when we do these kind of solutions for optimizing CO2 emission is we need to automate it and make it easy for the shipper to do the things. Because often the decision maker is not the one who’s going to do it, it’s his 30 people sitting in the dispatching department, and they need that we not going to change any any user interface for them. We’re not used to changing any processes, so we’re making sure that their everyday life will just have this extra optimization point. When we do it like this, we do see a. Has huge success. It has a huge success. We have we really and the good thing about working with data is that we can also say afterwards, this is what you said, put it in your hand. We can give you the return of investment right away. And you can start saying home and start getting a relationship to CO2 emissions. Because I will tell you, I don’t believe that anyone out there, including myself, has a big connection to CO2 emissions. I don’t know how much CO2 should be in a chocolate bar. If it’s 60 or 16 or 600 grams of CO2. And doing what we’re doing right now, we do see that our customers are starting to get a relationship to these numbers that we’re giving them.

Scott Mears  30:41

I mean, you totally there’s going to be an interesting world when we’re no more just looking on the ROI of finance, we’re actually looking what’s the ROI on the CO2 emissions of that. That’s going to be really interesting when that just becomes a standard. And a question added to this is you mentioned now that sometimes is depending on the level of data that the company has. It can be 400% or even a 25% accurate to the number. What sort of cost implications? Because, of course, if we were to predict off the base of that data, the the cost implications to to the shipper and to the carrier if they were to make the wrong decision. Are you finding that as a pushback? I guess that’s the first two category of companies you mentioned earlier, the ones that aren’t really embracing it. Do you find there’s a bit of a worry in regards to daring to predict at the moment with this data, because it’s not accurate enough, because of the implications it could have.

Jakob Muus  31:48

Actually, not really. The thing is that those companies that really want to do this, because we’re in such an early stage, they are really first movers, so they know what they’re dealing with, and we also very careful that from my product team at Transporeon, we are not creating any user interfaces for you to use and to interact with. We are sending data to a user interface that you normally use. So basically, we’re giving the option to optimize on the third optimization point. But one day, if you’re sitting and wanting to send something away, and you know that time is of essence, then you just like, ignore the other factor. It’s a little bit like when you buy an airline a ticket to go on holiday. You could also sort of like, sometimes money is of essence. Then you okay. Then you don’t mind that you have to fly for 22 hours and have three stopovers, and otherwise, sometimes you want to, you want to optimize for for time. Sometimes you want to optimize for how long the layout overs are, and so on and so forth. So what we’re basically doing is we’re giving this extra level in an optimized for but we also know that sometimes, if you’re a food producer, or if you’re like, yeah, if you’re food producer, and you just know that this product just needs to be shipped today, otherwise it’s too late, then ship it. Then, by all means, ship it. And but we are giving you., we allow you to have eyes on it, so to speak.

Scott Mears  33:25

Fantastic. That’s now, that’s great insight to see. And I look forward to people digesting this episode, because it’s they’re going to learn a lot and and hopefully it moves those companies forwards to dare to be the first movers. I want to finish off on a final question, maybe a bit of a loaded question, is, do you feel this technology will showcase companies out there who are greenwashing versus trying to actually decrease their CO2 emissions?

Jakob Muus  34:00

I think, I think there are two there are two levels to it. You have what I like to call the carbon ERPs, who are gathering the data from different operations in a company and making sure that you making sure that you have the best data gathered, and you have the ability to allocate on a product level and and make decisions on it. They often sit at the CFOs office on strategy department. And then you have companies that are delivering data to these ERPs as poor as one company delivering granular data so that these calculations can become more and more precise on the transport part, but not on the other parts. They still need to get the electricity data on their electricity consumption or heat consumption and so on and so forth. I think that the whole movement towards this internalization of CO2 emissions and. And usage of these carbon ERPs. Yes, they’re definitely going to show not just who is greenwashing and making good marketing, that’s one thing, but actually also on the second point, who they’re going to show who is not having their house in order. Because measuring CO2 emissions and only operations will also show you where do you have holes. So what I see is that the coolest companies out there, those who have really, really good CEOs and really, really good management, they have started to do it because they would rather find out where they have holes in their systems and in their structures, and find out how to repair it. Then that someone else, from, I don’t know, from some rating company, a financial rating company, who will do it in one year and say, Oh, these people don’t have the housing order. Let’s short them. So what I do see, again, back to the whole point that this is become a CS CFO topic, I do see that the coolest companies out there see this as an opportunity to go in and really have their eyes on it. Because one thing is, what we do with CO2 emissions, and yes, we can brag about that. We’re going to buy some electric vehicles and so on and so forth. And it made some good headlines. But the most important part is, it is showing your dirty underwear if and and you can’t hide it, it is like, if you don’t look at it yourself, someone else is going to look at it. So it’s sort of like, it’s like we do see that it’s going to give more clarity. And again, the coolest companies out there have already started to act on it. And my very optimistic hope is that it’s just going to be a natural thing. We are internalizing CO2 emissions. It’s going to be a factor. And those people who really want to optimize, they look at it and say, Oh, we have some big hole here. Why is that? And then they can decide, is time or money or CO2 more important in this little operation, that they can make an active decision and not be surprised by a rating agency in two, three years.

Scott Mears  37:09

I think that’s that’s a great point and a great finish to really hit it home, the value and the reasons to to really take this seriously. Either you can really recognize the problems yourself and be ahead of it and overcome this and become a better company. Or someone’s going to come knocking on your door at some point, and you can have a lot of angry people there ready to take all your dirty under underwear out. So if we don’t want to see all the dirty underwear on the road, we would rather go be ahead of the game in the industry and and it’s wonderful to have you on because it’s just, it’s, it’s an area that needs to be driven further. It’s, I love seeing, going to events. It’s spoken about a lot. I’ve seen, we’ve seen regularly, many companies talking about what they’re doing to become carbon neutral by 2030, 2050, their their their goals. And for you to be at the front of that, driving that, and be the engine that is allowing us to achieve that, it’s just wonderful. And I appreciate you and Transporeon and all the other companies out there that are doing this. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you very much, Jakob. We’ll just do a little wave the social media guys like this. If you just throw your hand up and just do a little wave like this. They like to clip that up. But thank you again, Jakob. I really appreciate you, and I wish you all the best.

Jakob Muus  38:28

Yeah, thank you.

Scott Mears  38:30

Thank you all the best.Hi, my name is Scott Mears, and I’m one of the hosts of the Supply Chain Tech Podcast with Roambee. On this podcast we talk to supply chain heroes from around the world about everything, ranging from the disruptions related to supply chains, their personal experiences with tracking technologies, strategies to build resilience, and much, much more. We already have some recommended videos for you to the side of me, and if any of this sounds interesting to you, do subscribe to our Youtube channel and hit the bell icon so you don’t miss another Roambee video. I’ll see you next time.